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Re: The JNCC spreadsheet and Recorder.

Following a mention on the previous topic;

We have used the JNCC taxon designation spreadsheet as a way of identifying species of importance.
As a document it collates all of the designations in one place for each taxon, more or less.
This may not be the most elegant way of doing things, but as we have limited resources (three man days a week) it seemed to provide a workable solution.

Is JNCC going to update this spreadsheet and hold it up as THE definitive collation for each taxon, and will what is represented in the spreadsheet be implemented directly into Recorder. (Or vice versa)
Can I rely on this spreadsheet representing what is in recorder dictionary?


And a query on how the spreadsheet is written.
If you look at Alauda arvensis. (one of a good number).
We have the taxon Alauda arvensis with the designations for Birds Dir and Bird:red but no BAP listing.
We then have the sub species arvensis/scotica with the BAP listing only. (Neither of the other designations).

I suspect that from a technical taxonomic point of view there may be a reason for this? (breeding populations, verses migrants or some such nonsense)
It just doesnt make the spreadsheet as usable as it might be.
(Observations are made of 'Skylark', hence Recorder6 reports 'Skylark' and any cross reference to the spreadsheet is on 'Skylark' - not the sub species [unless you have a serious recording community]).

Recorder dictionary thinks that both the species and sub species are BAP designated...!

I'll be interested to hear what JNCC's position is on this spreadsheet.

Thanks in advance.
MAtt

Cumbria Biodiversity Data Centre
Tullie House Museum

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Re: The JNCC spreadsheet and Recorder.

Hi Matt,

Are you talking about the designations spreadsheet downloadable from the JNCC website? If so this is produced from the database that the list in Recorder called JNCC Collation of taxon designations is from. These are essentially the same database of information just presented in a different way. This list is currently being updated in the species dictionary and so will be in the next upgrade to the species dictionary and there will also be a new version of the spreadsheet available from the JNCC site.
I'll hopefully get back to you with answers to your more specific questions.
Lynn

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Re: The JNCC spreadsheet and Recorder.

I have obtained the following information from Dave Chambers of our Data Services team who has been involved in assembling the spreadsheet and also the UK BAP information.

You raise a very interesting point about matching trinomials and binomials. I'm not sure we can propose an easy solution.

The taxonomic level of recording of the bird species was subject to a lot of debate but in the end, the inter-agency UK BAP priority species and habitats review group agreed to the recommendations of the Bird expert sub-group led by Bob Gibbons of the RSPB.

The footnotes on Page 18  of the final report http://www.ukbap.org.uk/library/BRIG/SHRW/SpeciesandHabitatReviewReport2007andAnnexes1-3.pdf
give some ideas of how birds should be dealt with.

Personally, I think that we should have linked "Alauda arvensis arvensis/scotica" explicitly to Alauda arvensis - and  Carduelis cannabina autochthona/cannabina to Carduelis cannabina. We might consider doing this for future releases.
However it would be a mistake to match all starling to - Sturnus vulgaris UK BAP because if they are Shetland breeders they are a separate race that is not declining and is therefore not BAP listed! 
It’s a minefield

Dave Chambers

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Re: The JNCC spreadsheet and Recorder.

Lynn /Dave,

Thank you for that - much appreciated.

Geographical context is everything.

'Sigh' - it's the burden we carry.

MAtt

Cumbria Biodiversity Data Centre
Tullie House Museum

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Re: The JNCC spreadsheet and Recorder.

Lynn Heeley wrote:

Personally, I think that we should have linked "Alauda arvensis arvensis/scotica" explicitly to Alauda arvensis - and  Carduelis cannabina autochthona/cannabina to Carduelis cannabina. We might consider doing this for future releases.

Bumping this thread.......

Chris, I think Alauda arvensis arvensis/scotica should be a synonym of Alauda arvensis Linnaeus, 1758 not of the subspecies, Alauda arvensis arvensis Linnaeus, 1758 as it is currently. The designations for this (needed) "made up" name are being applied to the subspecies as a result, when in fact they should refer to the species?

There are no other subspecies recorded in Britain to cause any problems, with scotica itself being ignored long ago?

Charlie Barnes
Information Officer
Greater Lincolnshire Nature Partnership