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Topic: Reporting on designations

Just noticed some problems when trying to report on some designations. I know the BOCC4 lists have been updated in R6 but when I extract data and look at the Bird:Red and Bird:Amber statuses they are completely incorrect (see screenshot attached). In the example all three species should be listed as red. Pretty sure this is isn't to do with the designations being at sub-species level.

Is it just me or is there a wider problem?

Mike, any ideas?

MARK

Mark Pollitt
SWSEIC (formerly DGERC)

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Re: Reporting on designations

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Mark Pollitt
SWSEIC (formerly DGERC)

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Re: Reporting on designations

I have looked at the source data and I think R6 is reflecting what is there. However, it looks very strange to me. I am unclear which Taxon List type is supposed to be holding the Bird:Amber and Bird:Red list. There seem to be three taxon lists types holding the information, with no one list type holding the latest information.  There isn't much more I can do as I don't understand what was intended, however, I will ensure that JNCC are aware of the issue.

Mike Weideli

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Re: Reporting on designations

I'm not sure what the statuses should be - I'm not an expert on bird designations. But if I look at Long-tailed Duck the "BAmb" status expired in 2009 while the "BRed" status is still in force. Is it to do with the "to date"? Or are you looking at other statuses? I see the picture but I don't know what I'm supposed to be looking at or what is wrong so if you can elaborate and give me some examples here (in text preferably because the image if difficult to read) then I can investigate. :)

Chris Raper, Manager of the UK Species Inventory, Angela Marmont Centre for UK Biodiversity,
Natural History Museum, Cromwell Road, London, SW7 5BD.  (tel: 020 7942 5894)
also Tachinid Recording Scheme (http://tachinidae.org.uk/)

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Re: Reporting on designations

On further investigation it appears that in a standard version of R6 only the taxon Designation Types of Bird-Red  (DTK NHMSYS0020443052) and Bird-Amber (DTK NHMSYS0020443051) are relevant as these are the only Red/Amber types in the 'JNCC collation of taxon designations'.  However, of the 246 Taxon_Designations  for these only there are 62 Amber and  24 Red  taxa without a date end, only a fraction of the number I think should be there.

Mike Weideli

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Re: Reporting on designations

Certainly, when it comes to testing for designations it is best to use the JNCC Collation (TAXON_LIST_KEY="NHMSYS0020424779") because this is the current summary and should agree with the spreadsheet of designations available on the JNCC website. Then also only bring out ones with DATE_TO=NULL because this will exclude superseded designations.

Chris Raper, Manager of the UK Species Inventory, Angela Marmont Centre for UK Biodiversity,
Natural History Museum, Cromwell Road, London, SW7 5BD.  (tel: 020 7942 5894)
also Tachinid Recording Scheme (http://tachinidae.org.uk/)

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Re: Reporting on designations

Hello,
I understand that the designations in Recorder reflect the designations in the most recent JNCC list. Unfortunately I can't find designations for some species in Recorder, which I can find in the JNCC list. That seems to affect mostly beetles (Agelastica alni, Crudosilis ruficollis, Drilus flavescens, Platycis minutus, Sitaris muralis, Diaperis bolete). I have the dictionaries installed until 0000003E only and have asked our IT, to install the most recent dictionaries (until 0000003N). Does anybody know, if these dictionaries would update all designations to the level of the most recent JNCC list?
I couldn't find a documentation about that and I fear it might not be the case, because the above mentioned beetles don't even have the designations from the JNCC list from 2014. That could mean, that one of the last updates removed some of the designations?
I've rebuilt the indexes and I run the following SQL to check the designations: SELECT DISTINCT INDEX_TAXON_NAME.PREFERRED_NAME, Index_Taxon_Designation.Taxon_List_Item_Key FROM INDEX_TAXON_NAME LEFT JOIN Index_Taxon_Designation ON INDEX_TAXON_NAME.TAXON_LIST_ITEM_KEY = Index_Taxon_Designation.Taxon_List_Item_Key WHERE (((INDEX_TAXON_NAME.PREFERRED_NAME)="Agelastica alni"));
Is there somebody, who can help please?

Thanks,
Wolfgang

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Re: Reporting on designations

Hello

The Birds of Conservation Concern 4 list was updated in the JNCC Conservation Designations spreadsheet last year but these changes do not appear to match the subsequent updates in the UK Species Inventory's Taxon Designations table, leading to the reported mismatch between JNCC's Designation spreadsheet and the UKSI designations seen in Recorder 6.

Working with Chris Raper, the UKSI's Taxon Designation table has now been updated to more closely match the taxon designations present within the JNCC's Taxon Designation database. The update should hopefully address the issues currently seen with the Bird:Amber and Bird:Red list in Recorder 6.

Best wishes
Graham

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Re: Reporting on designations

Hello

Is it possible to get an update on when the corrections will be made and when a revised dictionary update will be available?

For those that haven't upgraded beyond dictionary update 3B ... I think the errors crept in with updates 3C to 3E so I'd suggest not applying 3C onwards unless you are happy the incorrect red/amber lists won't affect you.

Andy

Andy Foy, Ecologist & IT consultant
Andy Foy Consulting

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Re: Reporting on designations

I have been in touch with Chris Raper and he says he has some changes in progress for a new  CEH Freshwater Checklist which are in the final stages of checking. Once this is done he will make a new update available which will include the changes  mentioned above.

Mike Weideli

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Re: Reporting on designations

Hi

I notice that other designations disappeared during the dictionary update 3C to 3E.  For example, the WACA Taxon_Designation records for 'Natrix natrix' were all deleted in update 3E but I can't find any replacement Taxon_Designation records inserted around that time.  Other species similarly affected include all the other amphibian and reptile UK species.

Was this a planned change or have these species also been affected by an error in the UKSI's Taxon Designation table?  In which case can these be fixed asap as it is important to be able to report on these species correctly.

Thanks
Andy

Andy Foy, Ecologist & IT consultant
Andy Foy Consulting

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Re: Reporting on designations

Hi Andy, and others: see my comments on the Recorder 6>UK Species Inventory and Dictionaries thread regarding designation outputs, quite a few of which are wrong at least when we try to use R6 at the moment. My post is here

I am resorting to using species outputs with no designations from R6, but with a lookup list link to the entry on the latest JNCC designations spreadsheet. A client can click on a species to go to its entry on the JNCC spreadsheet, bypassing the R6 output.

Hopefully some of the glitches will be sorted out at the next dictionary update.

Linda

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Re: Reporting on designations

Hi

Is there any news on when we'll get a dictionary update containing the corrections to the missing/incorrect designations (e.g. the BOCC red/amber species)?

Thanks
Andy

Andy Foy, Ecologist & IT consultant
Andy Foy Consulting